shy thunder Posted November 3, 2004 Report Share Posted November 3, 2004 yes would like to see how a spinaker and a modern rig affect the performance of the mighty mari..... Have you got a set of hulls under you yet john? If you know of maris for sale post me some details as we are now fielding more enquiries here at Kurnell with people wanting to come to racing but without a large cash outlay and the mari sure suits the bill.... cheers dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emmessee Posted November 3, 2004 Report Share Posted November 3, 2004 A foam sanwich Mari has been produced, but not with any exotics. Warren and Bris Cat Centre has confirmed this. It would be interesting if a Mari was made at about 70kg's with an upgraded rig to see how it would go. Even for the older boats, a sail upgrade would benefit greatly as sail designs and materials have come so far in the last couple of decades that it is something that could be considered. I hear they cries already. It is a slow development that takes place with people getting the new sail only when needed. You have 2 classes for a short time until the new sail takes over. Nacra did it with the 5.8 with the foil bridle, and the Windies did it as well as many other classes. It is something to be considered to get younger people back to the class, and you never know, they may start making them again in bigger numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweet16 Posted November 4, 2004 Report Share Posted November 4, 2004 Dave, I have most parts now, just waiting on a mast and boom. Just about given up on the one I ordered from Brisbane and may have to just set up an old section (lighter anyway as people mentioned in earlier posts). Have waited 3 weeks now for mast and boom. If I had known it would take so long to get parts then would never have sold Sweet16. Will do without a trailer for the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweet16 Posted November 5, 2004 Report Share Posted November 5, 2004 A mast is on the way from Brisbane now, should be able to pick it up tonight, fit it out, and go sailing tomorrow The boat is called ZAX (3 letters is not expensive in stick on vinyl). So future postings from me could be as ZAX. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAX Posted November 7, 2004 Report Share Posted November 7, 2004 Picture of Square Top Maricat for those interested mari_squared Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emmessee Posted November 8, 2004 Report Share Posted November 8, 2004 Does it go any faster with that rig??? I have always been a believer in updating a class occasionally to keep up with new technology and innovations. Not every year as it is to expensive, but to look at it every 25 years in the case of the Maricat would not be a bad thing. The young blokes and gals this day will be attracted to the Maricats if they had the latest rig developments. In the case of the Maricat, I think that the only thing that needs to be looked at is the rig, sails in particular. You could keep the same mast, but a new main using better and lighter materials and a better shape would be sensational, and not an expensive thing to do to update your boat and also look sensational and go much faster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted November 8, 2004 Report Share Posted November 8, 2004 John, thanks for posting the photo. The sail looks great. Boat looks pretty flash as well. How did Zax go under the new sail? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAX Posted November 8, 2004 Report Share Posted November 8, 2004 ZAX is vastly improved under the new sail. It fly's ! I also have a spinnaker but will not be using it at the 14 regatta next weekend due to timing problems. I only got the mast late on Friday night and will be away most of this week with no time to fit the kite. The times on Saturdays race had ZAX 13 minutes ahead of the next maricat. Usually I would be within 5 minutes of most of the other club maricats. I know one race is not enough to go on but it looks promising. There is no adjustment needed to boom or mast to fit the new sail and it is made by an Association Sail maker (Geoff Adams) so easy for any maricatter to get hold of. Anyway, will see how it goes this weekend in a fleet of different 14's at Mannering Park. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shy thunder Posted November 9, 2004 Report Share Posted November 9, 2004 hi John/zax, What is the meterage of the square top? Is tacking downwind benificial to the square top? Has Geoff indicated any other variances that may be benificial to the design, (for heavy skippers)? What we need to do is like the Windies, the sail is made the same for all with no variances allowed at time of purchase. With one supplier / manufacturer of the the sail allowed. With this allowing the sailmaker to make up and keep stock on the shelf for those wanting a ready supply.????? Maybe have a tender to supply for 3yrs, with a sailoff over several races for different designs to be trialled with skippers swapping boats and sails to negate favouritism????????? looks good, might order one so I can pass Wayne on the work........... " tell him he's DREAMING......" LOL cheeers d Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAX Posted November 9, 2004 Report Share Posted November 9, 2004 Dave, There is about 1 meter extra in the square top sail. The sail is significantly lighter and the material holds its shape better as the wind increases. tacking downwind can be an advantage, should be able to race a similiar course with the supersloops downwind. It is much better upwind though, not only an advantage off the breeze. the square top tends to be a bit more automatic in reponse to gusts so although the area is larger it can actually be easier to sail with. Geoff has worked on developing the design particularly for the heavier sailors although it can be tuned with stiffer battens in the top for lighter sailors. Geoff is happy to supply the specifications of this sail to the Association to allow correct measurement etc. He will come to the 14 regatta at Mannering Park on the weekend if people have further questions on it from him. I am sure he would not mind to be sole distributor if that is what the class wants. Is that really a good thing though? Why not just the measurements being made available to all Association approved sail makers? Most likely people would buy from Geoff anyway as he makes great sails. having stock on the shelf would be a good thing though, don't like waiting weeks/months for parts. The sail definately makes the boat faster, and I think it looks better than the older design sails. You should have no problem passing any other maricat on a work with the square top (all other things being equal). If you are coming to Mannering Park on the weekend you are welcome to take it for a run. I am not sure what yardstick it should be on for the weekend regatta. Maybe the same as the super sloops? any suggestion? cheers ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emmessee Posted November 9, 2004 Report Share Posted November 9, 2004 I would think that it would be faster than a super sloop upwind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shy thunder Posted November 9, 2004 Report Share Posted November 9, 2004 goosneck looks low on the mast, can my large body fit under the boom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emmessee Posted November 9, 2004 Report Share Posted November 9, 2004 Roll through like I do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shy thunder Posted November 9, 2004 Report Share Posted November 9, 2004 don't know about a roll maybe a sqirm and a wriggle.... what may be better is the design measurements for the sail be made available so that it may be constructed the same by all sailmakers giving all a similar starting point....without the cost of trial and error trialling sailmakers, as finding the correct designs can be a costly exercise? john what is the signifigance of the 5.2 at the top of the sail...donor origins? of the material? what has darcy done to keep up with you? a bigger roach?.......LOL hope to be there for the saturday racing at least....wife may let me out to play...... hope the weather improves for the weekend cheers d [This message has been edited by shy thunder (edited 09 November 2004).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAX Posted November 9, 2004 Report Share Posted November 9, 2004 I had the sail altered today, it is still cut low at the front but higher at the back now to make it easy to fit under. In the pic, the sail is is on tight so it is higher when eased to tack also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAX Posted November 9, 2004 Report Share Posted November 9, 2004 The 2 above the maricat symbol is supposed to signify Mari Squared. Darcy was the next maricat home on Saturday 13 minutes back. No doubt he will have done something to improve speed for the 14 regatta this weekend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAX Posted November 9, 2004 Report Share Posted November 9, 2004 It is not 5.2 the sail is easy to see through, the 5 is a backwards 2 from the other side of the sail Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shy thunder Posted November 10, 2004 Report Share Posted November 10, 2004 SORRY REALISED THAT ON MY WAY HOME "MARI SQUARED".... cAN YOU REVEAL THE COST OF SUCH A SAIL? AT THE MOMENT....... MIGHT BE INTERESTED MYSELF TO HAVE A FIDDLE... CHEERS D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAX Posted November 12, 2004 Report Share Posted November 12, 2004 prices for the squaretop depend on the sail material used. If it is made from Dacron then the price is about the same as for a classic pin head sail. One like mine can be made from Pentex. A list of prices for each material is given below, all of these sails are an improvement over the standard sail. A$924 Dacron (as used in standard sails) A$1144 Ripstop Dacron (used by some e.g. Bob S.) A$1595 Pentex A$1914 Carbon I would recommend Pentex as the best value/performance of these sails and is longer wearing. I have tested each of the different materials. Have also tested a radial sail against the crosscut dacron squaretop and found the crosscut squaretop to perform better (some people might not agree with me on this I guess). Geoff said he is happy to supply the dimensions of th new sail to the maricat Association if desired. I would like to note that the dimensions of the current sail held by the association are not that accurate in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emmessee Posted November 17, 2004 Report Share Posted November 17, 2004 One thing to remember with the new mainsail for the Maricat or anything else you would want to change in the "class". Ross Guinnea at Brisbane Catamaran Centre paid for the rights of the Maricat, so the class can't just adopt a new sail without his consent, if I understand it correctly. I know that he would like nothing more than to start pumping out new Maricats especially ones that will appeal to sailors that would probably not have considered the class before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted November 17, 2004 Report Share Posted November 17, 2004 Any word on how ZAX went in the mixed 14 regatta last weekend? Would be good to get a report of who went well and why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest IMA MOUSE Posted November 17, 2004 Report Share Posted November 17, 2004 it is amazing what you hear when you travel away to regattas... latest scuttlebutt is that "Rosco" from Bris cat cent has made a foam sandwich mari 4.3 and is looking for a skipper to sail at nationals???? hey Graham is this true? hey Ross how much does it weigh? Andrew what can you tell us? anyone else fill us in with some facts, do I have to sell my timber boat and buy a foamy to beat the new boat fleet of Maris? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warrier Posted November 18, 2004 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2004 Not sure if all this talk of new hulls and new sails is going to do anything to increase numbers in the class and at the Nationals. The intrest and numbers sailing are just starting to increase.Ive got a feeling that talk like this might be the end of all the extra intrest.Keep the class cheap leave the big spending to other classes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emmessee Posted November 18, 2004 Report Share Posted November 18, 2004 Warrior, it won't stop it at all, if not anything it will increase it. Young guys today don't want to sail a Maricat unless someone has pointed them that way, like a friend or family member. If you ask around, they think that they are an old, outdated and boring boat that is sailed by the same blokes that were sailing them 20 years ago. They are not far off the truth. Give them something that they can say "wow, I want one of them" and they will be back in droves. A square top high performance sail, light enough to move around the beach themselves and some groovy graphics would transform the Maricat into something other sailors would aspire to. The Maricat Turbo, The Maricat Express or the Maricat XP. It is not changing the class, it would just be a slow progression of updating it, like many other classes have over the past decade. In another 20 years, there may not be any Maricats left as they are all aging and sooner or later they will break and not be able to get fixed. If a new foam sandwich square topped Mari with a kite kit was available, I am sure within a year there would be at least 5 of them racing, enough to have there own start line. Some of the older sailers will be against it and I understand why. They have been sailing the same boat for 20 years and know them backwards and they would not like to have to learn a new rig. Some of them may welcome it with open arms and enjoy the challenge. Either way, it should happen. It would also allow the heavier sailors a better chance as the boat would have more flotation. If a class wants to just put its head in the sand and hope that it will survive, that is fine, and there is every chance that it will, but no class that has advanced itself in technology has lost numbers. I think if anything, numbers have increased as they have in the expensive Tornado with a new rig, and also the Windrush and the Nacra 5.8. The cost only comes into it if you want to buy a brand new foam sandwich boat. If you want to stick with the Maricat Classic, then that will be the class for you. Just my opinion. [This message has been edited by Emmessee (edited 18 November 2004).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warrier Posted November 18, 2004 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2004 If you or anybody else has got between $8000 and $10000 to spend on a Maricat good luck to you. The reason I sail a Maricat is because I have a chance of beating other Maricats,I would have no chance at all of beating that- new boat where is the fun in that,for me and for the guy that pays the money and beats me by 15 minutes at the Nationals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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