14' Catamaran Association

[TornadoSport260]

In response to the NSW Windrush site not having a redirect link. Tripod (the hoster for that site) won't allow it. If you look at the HTML code of what I put up there it has the link but what is publicly displayed eliminates the redirect link.

[TornadoSport260]

here is the code uploaded:

Please visit our the new website of the Windrush & Prindle Association of NSW Inc.

www.nswwindrush14.org.au

And all it displays is:

Please visit our the new website of the Windrush & Prindle Association of NSW Inc.

[Dave]

Hi Michael,

Don't take the feedback received as negativity. Some people see some great reasons for forming a 14ft cat association, while others do not.

I fully agree that the insurance issues need to be addressed and discussed, preferably with more fact than opinion. For some of the classes, combining with other classes may be a great move and enable them to more easily overcome some of the issues they are dealing with.

THE COMBINED 14ft CAT CLASS ASSOCIATION

Some of the things Tony has raised are simply a reality of starting a new association. To address the insurance issues, it would definitely be better to have this new association incorporated. However, incorporation comes with quite a few obligations on the committee, including developing a "constitution" (based on the Model Rules), having nominated committee positions, feeding back information to NSW Fair Trading.

I would imagine that most of the people who would be interested in forming this new association would already be involved in a club or association committee, so this would be an added burden, although probably a worthwhile one in their eyes. You would have to consider if this association would make the existing ones for those classes redundant. If so, would each class represented in that association have equal representation on the committee and therefore in all matters that needed to be dealt with?

Different classes usually have different ways of doing things and probably spend their funds in different ways. Amalgamating these varying perspectives could be interesting and quite challenging. Currently, most of the sailors from the various classes get along well. However, in an environment of sharing their resources (such as in a combined classes association), would this continue, especially if one class sees another starting to dominate proceedings?

I don't offer up the above thoughts out of negativity. I offer them as points to consider, as things are often not as simple and straightforward as they seem. I've been on both club and class committees for over 25 years.

THE PERSPECTIVE OF THE PAPER TIGER CLASS

Currently, the Paper Tiger class is doing well numbers-wise and some of its associations are showing very good growth, especially Tasmania, New Zealand and South Africa. We have an established association structure at three levels (International, National, State) that has worked very well for around 40 years and continues to serve the class well. AGMs for the International Association (PTCIA) are held two years out of every three (at the International Championships) and yearly for the National and State Associations (NSW, Qld, SA, Tas and Vic).

The class has strong numbers at championships, with 40-50 at International Championships, around 50 at New Zealand Nationals, and close to 40 entered for the coming Australian Nationals. Three of the five Australian states (NSW, SA, Vic) have sufficient entries for their State Titles to have stand-alone events. Tasmania has utilised the TasCat event for their State Titles, although they now have enough boats to go it alone if they wanted to. Queensland has only recently re-formed their association and will be having their first State Titles for some years as part of the Lake Samsonvale New Year's Regatta on 14th & 15th January.

While not all will agree with me, I certainly prefer, as my favourite type of racing, a large fleet of boats of the one type. If this is not possible, mixed-class events are a good substitute. However, my first preference would always be a large one-design fleet. As the Paper Tiger class meets this desire for me (and for many others), we continue to organise our championship events as stand-alone events, rather than combine with other classes. However, we certainly enjoy mixed-class racing for our other events, like Traveller's Trophy style events.

I give the above outline of the Paper Tiger class to explain why we do not see an advantage to us in combining with other classes to form a new association. It is not out of arrogance or elitism, but rather a high level of satisfaction with our current arrangements.

I certainly encourage other smaller classes to seriously consider this proposed combined class association, as the benefits probably outweigh the disadvantages for them. However, please understand the position of the Paper Tiger class and why we are choosing to retain our current arrangements.

Regards,

David Stumbles

Secretary, NSWPTCA

Secretary, PTCIA

[tonyquoll]

Well said Dave. My objections to the proposed NSW 14' Cat Association are: - its primary purpose is to provide public liability insurance, which I believe is an unnecessary expense- the logistics of making the group work would be exceeding difficult- as we can already organise events, such as this year's traveller series, a formal association is unnecessaryThe positive I see in the situation, is that it reveals a need for Maricat and Windrush Associations to build membership. Helpful tips provided above.Thanks TornadoSport for pointing out the contact info at: http://nswwindrush14.org.au/?page_id=2Although I was specifically looking for contact details and association membership, that line of text at the bottom of the page eluded me. I'd go a dedicated "Contacts" page, with details of the association, boat retailer, parts outlets, clubs, etc.I spotted an error in the HTML code provided above: no closing quotation mark in the link. Possibly Tripod's auto-formatting eliminated it for that reason. Suggest trying this:

Please visit our the new website of the Windrush & Prindle Association of NSW Inc.www.nswwindrush14.org.au

Hope it's going well at Sail Sydney! Wish I was there but decided to save the $. Expecting a great day of racing and partying at Wallagoot!

[tonyquoll]

Well said Dave. My objections to the proposed NSW 14' Cat Association are: - its primary purpose is to provide public liability insurance, which I believe is an unnecessary expense- the logistics of making the group work would be exceeding difficult- as we can already organise events, such as this year's traveller series, a formal association is unnecessaryThe positive I see in the situation, is that it reveals a need for Maricat and Windrush Associations to build membership. Helpful tips provided above.Thanks TornadoSport for pointing out the contact info at: http://nswwindrush14.org.au/?page_id=2Although I was specifically looking for contact details and association membership, that line of text at the bottom of the page eluded me. I'd go a dedicated "Contacts" page, with details of the association, boat retailer, parts outlets, clubs, etc.I spotted an error in the HTML code provided above: no closing quotation mark in the link. Possibly Tripod's auto-formatting eliminated it for that reason. Suggest trying this:

Please visit our the new website of the Windrush & Prindle Association of NSW Inc.www.nswwindrush14.org.au

Hope it's going well at Sail Sydney! Wish I was there but decided to save the $. Expecting a great day of racing and partying at Wallagoot!

[TornadoSport260]

so we can get some legal advise on the insurance topic here is a flow chart i put together. if anyone wants to have something changed on it just let me know. i believe that there will need to be changes to it but best to get other opinions.

[Scuttlebutt]

This looks pretty good. Not much I would change.

regards

mark

[humungus2]

I am haveing trouble following it.

[TornadoSport260]

So basically it says Joe Blogs (sailor) has a personal insurance policy for his boat which covers a few things like third party & accidental damage to property (ie. the boat).

Joe Blogs becomes a member of an affiliated club which intern makes him a member for YNSW/YA (provided he paid the YA fee like he should), which also covers him by a limited Personal Accident policy.

He then joins a state association (which should be affiliated to YNSW/YA) to become eligible to race at States/Nationals.

That association then decides to hold an event and appoints a host club (this club should have its own Public Liability, Professional Indemnity & Third Party insurance). The host club then conducts with the help of the association the particular event, in which Joe Blogs competes.

So from that a Lawyer should be able to determine where the responsibilities lie and who is liable in the event of a mishap. Of course they would also need things like a sample NOR, SI's etc

[tonyquoll]

Nice work. However, in the event of needing to make a claim for compensation for injury, a sailor contacts OAMPS directly, rather than going through the club, YNSW, YA and then insurer.

[TornadoSport260]

That may be so, but its not the path in which the insurance is assumed.