HooD Posted January 17, 2007 Report Share Posted January 17, 2007 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HooD Posted January 17, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2007 Out of the frying pan into the fire I know all of us who sail nacra's love our boats, on the water they are great fun and a pleasure to sail. for me about the only down side is the dated rig, the ol pin head is just not what it used to be and the dacron looks 1980's. I would love to see the option for a pentax material in either a pin head format or square top. it would make righting the boat so much easier pus more controlable in the heavy stuff. most of the photos above are sails built by the original nacra sailmakers in the US. I guess it would be the equivelent of going to manders direct and asking for a square top in pentax. just my thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leapin Leroy Posted January 17, 2007 Report Share Posted January 17, 2007 Wonderful, just Wonderful.... Now just got to come up with someone to sponsor the re-fit of all the competitive sorts currently sailing, appease the manufacturer and the class Association, then devise a "grandfather or greensleeves clause" that's acceptable to everyone, and succeed in not f#*king the class for every one who currently owns one? As a concept it is short-sighted, this type of radical changes to a One-design has seen the demise of a number of classes and manufacturers over the years... If you want a square head, put it in a vice or... Buy an F18, F16, F14, A-Class or Moth, or better still come up with a way of succeeding where no one else has before.... Just my thoughts too, jeez a gaff rig looks good, maybe my Heron nightmare isn't one after all... Luv, Leroy;( [This message has been edited by Leapin Leroy (edited 18 January 2007).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leapin Leroy Posted January 17, 2007 Report Share Posted January 17, 2007 Further, why are Laser's, Hobie's, Heron's, J-24's, Etchells (and the list goes on), still being sailed competitively at a State, National & International level? Not for their new Square heads that's for sure!!! Grrrrrrrrrrrr Leroy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HooD Posted January 17, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2007 Originally posted by Leapin Leroy: Buy an F18, F16, F14, A-Class or Moth, or better still come up with a way of succeeding where no one else has before.... ( f18 - Too heavy f-16 - too short for non jockey sailors f-14 - single hander a-class - more single handness Moth - haw many of us can sail a pogo stick? Its a pity we cant have the nacra setup the same as the hobie waves, max sail area and you do what you like. They have realized that different sailors require different sails. Hobie wave - good news story yeah? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catsailor.net Posted January 17, 2007 Report Share Posted January 17, 2007 Don't forget that Dacron is a much easier sail to control because of its stretch characteristics. The Pentax is a much less forgiving sail and also is far more fragile and expensive. The square top will encourage the 5.8 to nosedive. Worst thing we ever did was put kites on the 5.8 - It nearly killed the class. Now that the 5.8 is growing again and we have a core group that is really buzzing the last thing you need is to change the sails. Just my thoughts.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Village Idiot Posted January 17, 2007 Report Share Posted January 17, 2007 yeh why stop at a exotic sq top main , lets go a self tacking headsail and a assametrical shute and hell why were at it lets throw on a carbon wing mast ,I got a spare $12000 in my back pocket ,yeh sure it's going to be more efficient and a dream to sail but the extra coin your talking about will kill the fleet . the 5.8 has maintained the sail plan it has for a good reason , it's one design or as one design as your going to get in a off the beach cat ,it's simple ,it's durable and it's cheap ,I think you would crap your pants if you got a quote for someone to build you a square top pantax main !!!!form people I've talked to you'd be out of pocket $3000/$3500 for a main alone,then you've got to put batterns in it!! and hey guess what your still stuck with a tree trunk for a mast ,for a lot less you can put a complete new set of sails on your 5.8 and the good thing is that they are all the same, and lets face how many pantex mains are going to be sailing round when their 10/15 years old My opinion is that if you have the money yes do what you want with your boat at club level if you want to go a carbon wing mast and teknora sails ,go for it , put a friggin 50 hp yamaha on the back if you fell the need ,,,,but at any nacra event you wish to sail in ,as a 5.8 under class rules you must go back to the standard rig ,myself personally I would not waste my money as I believe the current rig is as good as you could expect for the $$$$ . Leroy I agree with you 100% IMO this topic is just trying to cause a shit fight !!!!and Hood you don't need our permission or approval to do whatever the hell you want to do to your boat,,, just my thoughts!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HooD Posted January 17, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2007 Duno about you guys but I have sailed a lot of square top boats in my time, including taipans, a-class, cobra, stingray, windsurfers, and never had a lot of problems with nose diving. If anything the 5.8 has to be one of the least nose divey boats out there! The guys on these pictures have gone the whole hog and increased the sail plan significantly. I wouldnt want to go that way, I would prefer to see the leech straightened up to give it a more modern look. circa 165sq ft of mainsail should not cost much more than a a-class main @ 135sq ft which was about 2k last time i checked. Yeah i know nothing will ever change, such is life. The bottom photo has an interesting story attached, the boat itself has been destroyed by a tornado but the sails which were stored seperately survived and are for sale. [This message has been edited by HooD (edited 17 January 2007).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xmatelot Posted January 17, 2007 Report Share Posted January 17, 2007 In my humble opinion, one of the most successful, long lasting, pleasurable,affordable,easily kept competetive,(put a Bridle Foil on an older boat),the ease of obtaining spare parts, readily given advice,and all of the best things we desire , are what a NACRA 5.8 is, why contemplate changing any thing, except attitude. pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tornado Posted January 17, 2007 Report Share Posted January 17, 2007 circa 165sq ft of mainsail should not cost much more than a a-class main @ 135sq ft which was about 2k last time i checked. I do not agree with changing the 5.8 sail plan, however nothing stopping you for non class events..... FYI, pentex square tops are not as expensive as you may think. A Goodall main for Capricorn will set you back $1700 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xmatelot Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 who cares. pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leapin Leroy Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 Oh, yeah, i forgot, while your at it, add a boom........ To all those wishing to change what is, my suggestion would be that you try to become a bigger fish in a larger pond by learning to sail what you have got. Go to a State or National titles and compete at that level... What "you can't win there" i hear you say... Good stay in your backwater and be King of the Kids... (OOPS, may upset the delicate types with that 1). Hey that gives me an idea, I can't win with my Rotax Go-Kart... "Hello. is this Stone Brothers Racing... Yeah, yeah, great, I want to put a V8 Engine in my kart so i can win", "Sweet only $350,000 you say, fine, cheques in the mail"... Sail the arse off the 5.8 and there is nary a non-spinnaker production boat that'll beat it, go to a Nationals and sail the arse off the 5.8 and you might actually win something. Again the point is; you want a development boat go sail a development class. 1. Throwing a hand-grenade into a room then running away only serves to destabilise the class(es) that you are all working hard to develop and generally f*#@ing resale values. 2. The credibility of on line forums such as this really goes down the s*hole when this type of discussion is the outcome. 3. Think you can do it better, spend the money and start manufacturing your own boats. Then see how long you can hang on to your customer base when you start changing things every year or on a whim. Here endeth the lesson. Keep playing with yourself and you will go blind. Put your money where your mouth is, then bend over and i'll slip you some common sense. (In hindsight, this 1 was a bit harsh too). Luv, Leroy [This message has been edited by Leapin Leroy (edited 18 January 2007).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cj Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 I like the look of the square top, i think ill get one of those. Ta for the info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cj Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 Nacra people use to be a friendly bunch of people. Too bad some people can't help themselfs:P Like your opinion is going to change my mind even with your cheap remarks pfffft as you would say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NacraPhelia628 Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 Too personal fellas... I think we all know that there won't be a square top on a 5.8 in the near or distant future. I agree with what was said before. If you want a square top by all means go and get one but it won't be allowed under the rules at the state and national level and as far as I'm concerned, thats where it counts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leapin Leroy Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 Ohhh, Boo Hoo... (oops, there we go again) The reason why people jump up and down about idiots who don't engage brain before putting mouth into gear is; A; We've been there and seen it before and it doesn't work... hard to reinvent the wheel. B; We/they have all invested significant time & money in that process. C; Most of us still have a financial interest by owning one of these boats... Losing money on deflating resale value is not fun in mine or most other peoples language. D; Free speech is to be applauded and a wonderful thing, we are all entitled it. Just don't whinge when you float a DUMB balloon and others, who also have the right to free speech, have a go at you for it! A bit of common sense can go a long way. Now, where did i put that article on the Heron. Luv, Leroy [This message has been edited by Leapin Leroy (edited 18 January 2007).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leapin Leroy Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 Sorry 628, that was meant for the prior response. Regards, The class rules supporter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cj Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 Leroy good to see you are passionate about the nacra class. But in saying that your opinion is just that and ill take it with a pinch of salt, i think around the 2k is cheap to have a play round in club races, i don't think anyone actually said lets make it nacra class legal did they? Only problem will be i know i will love a square top main and find it hard going back to the under performing pin head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
micky Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 Can someone please tell me why these topics are getting so heated lately. It is good that you are all passionate about OUR class, but guys lets keep it simple, non-personal and lets use a bit of common sense. The 5.8 is one of the best big boats ever built and is still the only one still going strong in OZ. Lets keep it that way by using our energy in a positive way!! Less time on the PC and net and more time on the water, save your money you spend on broadband and new computers and use that for fuel to get to the next Nacra regatta. Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HooD Posted January 18, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 Mick I could not agree more. it seems there are some people here who are taking every post/topic as a personal attack. chill out fellas. Looking back through the old topics and we have boat weight issues http://www.catsailor.net/cgi-bin/ubb/Forum5/HTML/000010.html 5 posts http://www.catsailor.net/cgi-bin/ubb/Forum5/HTML/000032.html 16 posts and neither of them were heated. back on topic, hobie 18's used to have a XL rig for people to play with, I don't know if they are still available or not, but that is mroe along the lines of what I would like. nacra 5.8ST has a ring to it p.s. have a look at my results form last year, http://www.lyc.catsailor.org/results0506.htm my worst result was a 3rd. I have no problems in that dept Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REV YUKKA II Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 hey it would be magic to have a double cevlar hulled 5.8 with carbon beams & mast plus what ever else you would have too do it to get it around 100kg fully rigged. the only trouble it now costs double and you have no one to race against. you end up with a hy-bread boat like the super 5.7 and no one to sail with. lets try and get the boats closer to each other not further away. even at club level you will not get good if your boat is way faster or you will get is lazy. i also agree that we should keep the language clean and personnal attacks out, i'm not sure if kid's read this site but ladies do so writing four letter word's in full is really not cool. i'll be putting my money where my mouth is this weekend at mannering park NSW NACRA SUPER SERIES, see you on the water REV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esteven Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 I wish I had the sort of money that people talk of here. I sail a hobie 14 that was owned previously by Noah, because it is all I can afford. I would love to sail a Nacra anything, but can't afford to. If I ever could it would be be one with a very small sail number. It's no fun still having to complete another lap of the course whilst everyone else is having their lunch. One design boats mean that we all eat lunch together, talk together and exchange views of the world together. Why spoil that commraderie by letting those with big chequebooks eat lunch early. All it does is reinforce their opinion of their own superiority. I don't understand the big issue about winning. I sail for fun, and fun alone. I think if you have a need to win, then take your chequebook to an open design class, and try and buy yourself a win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leapin Leroy Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 Thank you both and my apologies. Back in the 80's there were a couple of very good boats that went to the grave yard along with their manufacturers, all because people wanted to tinker with an already good thing. I AM passionate about not seeing it happen again to a class & manufacturer that i have been involved with since 1984. The Hobie 18XL was the beginning of the end... can anyone else draw the same conclusion as to why it happened? Well said on the cheque book front and getting good in your boats, both your input summed it up. "Hey Lyn, have you seen that Heron article anywhere?" Best Regards, Leroy [This message has been edited by Leapin Leroy (edited 18 January 2007).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cj Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 Am i missing something here? Has anyone mentioned taking a square top to a nationals? Has anyone mentioned wanting to use a square top for the pure purpose of going faster to win a race? What has been mentioned is people getting a square top for there own purpose of having more control of there boat and at the same time enjoying hopfully abit more speed to have FUN with. Nowhere did anyone mention for the sole purpose of winning races. Zac with his maricat has a square top which he uses @ club level and no-one seems to mind. As for people winning races cause they have money and the what if's, i am afraid that has been happening for years. Look @ age of boats that just won maricat and also our beloved nacras. You guys have just told them they have brought themself's a nationals. I suppose at the end of the day $$$ does win you races:P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leapin Leroy Posted January 19, 2007 Report Share Posted January 19, 2007 Realistically, sure they look good, BUT it's no longer a 5.8... Is it good for the class as a whole AND all the other owners? Is it going to have a posative outcome? Yes, no, maybe... History shows the outcome from this tinkering! Go for it, if that's what floats your boat. Will it help you sail faster at the States or Nationals? Big money to whizz around the buoys at home, why not buy a new main before the Nats, why not actually go? Who knows.... 42 is the answer. Love is in the air, Leroy [This message has been edited by Leapin Leroy (edited 19 January 2007).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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