stingray580 Posted December 31, 2010 Report Share Posted December 31, 2010 the new mainsail has arrived, and its friggin awesome, havent rigged it up yet as it was blowing its a** off in murray bridge today , but here are some happy snaps!!!! its just like xmas all over again!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev.263 Posted January 4, 2011 Report Share Posted January 4, 2011 To quote Huey Lewis and the news....."Its hip to be square....." Nice..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingray580 Posted January 12, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2011 hahahaha thanks kev!! hopefully getting a sail next weekend against todd . i will post somemore pics of it when it is vertical. im sure todd wants a very close look as he not happy!!!!! my suggestion was eating more hamburgers!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Dowling Posted January 12, 2011 Report Share Posted January 12, 2011 Very interesting - but it doesn't look like it would fit the specs in the measurement schedule I have or that listed on the website. Have the class rule been changed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingray580 Posted January 12, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2011 yes john, the rules have changed to allow an upgrade of the mainsail, this has been done to allow a continuation of a great class into the formula 18 class and also to keep the stingrays a little more on the pace. i beleive three boats are now running the square top sail, myself, rex gibbs and mitch bayliss, who was instrumental in getting this to happen.i see it as a good thing!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Dowling Posted January 12, 2011 Report Share Posted January 12, 2011 yes john' date=' the rules have changed to allow an upgrade of the mainsail, this has been done to allow a continuation of a great class into the formula 18 class and also to keep the stingrays a little more on the pace. i beleive three boats are now running the square top sail, myself, rex gibbs and mitch bayliss, who was instrumental in getting this to happen.i see it as a good thing!!![/quote'] Goodo. So how was the change made and when did it happen. What are the specifications for the new main and where are they published. There doesn't seem to be anything about this on the website. Are the old mains grandfathered and have any other speciications for the boat been changed. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingray580 Posted January 14, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 dont quote me on this john, but i bellieve it happened like this it happened when mitch bayliss asked for a new mainsail from greg goodall, greg suggested/made a square top F18 type mainsail for mitch. mitch said it wont measure. greg made it, we liked it, rules where changed. rex then bought one. i have just recieved mine . rules i beleive have not yet been rewritten but rex is in the process of it. certainly the old mains are still legal. the square to has the same size sail area, just a wider headboard. i believe there is chat about bringing in spinnakers but not makeing it compulsory. i for one am not keen on stingrays going to compulsory kites for the reason that i sail with my kids aged 10/12 and they will have no chance of hanging onto a big assy. BUT for raceing in open class raceing i.e. F18 definately!!! i will be setting up my boat to run a kite purely so i can keep up with the taipan 5.7s that race at milang / kingston etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HooD Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 "rules where changed. rex then bought one. i have just recieved mine . rules i beleive have not yet been rewritten but rex is in the process of it" how on earth do you change rules that have not been written? priceless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingray580 Posted January 14, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 its easy, you just dont write the rules down!!! WE know what they are!!! sorry should have said the written rules have not been updated as yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitchlb44 Posted January 15, 2011 Report Share Posted January 15, 2011 Hi John + Others Just to clear up a few things regarding the new sail plan. John - in answer to the "when, how, where" - The attendees of the Victor Harbor nationals last year held an "AGM" of sorts - The general consensus was that it is in the best interests of the class to get as many boats on the water as possible - As a result the rules in general have been relaxed (within reason). Things such as minumum weights, and hull/beam measurements all still remain! Rex was working on updating the rules... I had hoped to get a copy on the website last year... I'll stir him up again soon! F18: We are not able to be part of the F18 Class! We are 40-50kg under the minimum F18 weight! I asked the question late last year if they would grandfather the stingray with kite much the same as the F16's have done with the mozzys and cobras... they are not interested! SAIL PLAN: Restrictions on sail shape have been lifted - BUT OVERALL AREA REMAINS THE SAME! KITES: The intention is NOT to turn the class into a kite carrying class!! We have taken some measurements off my boat and will publish these soon - Club racing and ópen regattas are fine for kites - but the national titles will NOT allow kites! For those that wish to run kites we hope to create a sub-set of measurements so that we are all doing roughly the same thing, we may perhaps even look at getting a yardstick from YV. General observations suggest that the bighead main is still a work in progress - The first generation did not have enough shape in the head, both Myself and Rex have had our original sails modified. It will be interesting to see how Brian's Second Gen sail goes on the aussie wing mast! I will endevour to get some info on the website soon! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loose Change Posted January 15, 2011 Report Share Posted January 15, 2011 Is there a resurgence in popularity for the old girl and should I go and dig out my set of plans and start building? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NixonJr Posted January 15, 2011 Report Share Posted January 15, 2011 Yep sure is an interest in the old girl, I hope to have mine on the water in a couple of weeks and beat.. I mean sail against Mitch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Dowling Posted January 15, 2011 Report Share Posted January 15, 2011 Thanks for your responses Brian and Mitch. I'll just make this a quick reply as I'm completely buggered after two solid days of helping friends in the Brisbane floods. As the owner of the newest Stingray (I think) I'm very interested in these changes and am more than happy to help with documenting and clearly defining the changes so that the published specs can be updated. Tomorrow I'll send an email to the Association reps on the website - Mitch, Todd and Rex to set out what I can do if they are agreeable. Sorry Brian - I don't have your email but I can include you if you flick me a note at dowlingsatiprimus.com.au. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitchlb44 Posted January 15, 2011 Report Share Posted January 15, 2011 Loose - You definately should! Although finding a boat and getting it back on the water might be a bit easier than starting from scratch! Robbie - I'm looking forward to you coming and playing the with grown ups! John - Sounds great! Look forward to hearing from you! Also well done with your help in Brisbane! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingray580 Posted January 17, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 phew!!! thanks for clearing all that up mitch!!! you need to take some credit for getting the square top ball rolling i will let you know how the new main goes against the taipans on the weekend coming up mind you at milang last time with mark up front we were keeping up and at some stages beating them around the course and that was with the OLD main and NO kite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingray580 Posted January 17, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 mitch. you still interested in new mast??? i spoke to greg today and im convinced of the F18 mast is the way to go, i know its a much stiffer section but considering we have to use a spreader that is about 1/3 the size of standard F18 due to the overlapping jib. that is the way im going. if you want to order, lets do it soon. they didnt seem interested in getting a F16 section long enough for us. i know im going to have to get sail re cut but hey, its always an excuse to get another one!!!!! just dont want to snap my auswing with the kite up!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madboutcats Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 Just my opinion F18,Taipan section is a lot bigger heavier section than Stingray I reckon you are going to die in weather when you don't use the kite. I reckon your main sail might struggle to measure right when the added mast area is taken into account Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingray580 Posted January 17, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 i understand what your saying jeff, but will be carrying much less spreader length than what you do on the taipan. due to the overlapping jib. this will allow the section to be a bit more bendier than your setup. and i will still have the auswing ready to go. will have 2 complete setups. your forgetting that im 30 kg heavier than you are jeff!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingray580 Posted January 17, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 the other issue is, its the C2 section or a custom made carbon stick so its the C2!!! the taipan 4.9 section isnt made long enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingray580 Posted January 17, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 hopefully i will be catching up with super genius matt turley this week. he used to work at baverstock, he may have a few answers on what else can be done. ill keep you posted see you on saturday jeff!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Dowling Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 Just my opinion F18' date='Taipan section is a lot bigger heavier section than Stingray I reckon you are going to die in weather when you don't use the kite. I reckon your main sail might struggle to measure right when the added mast area is taken into account[/quote'] Jeff (madabout) The two mast sections currently approved within the measurement schedule for Stingrays are the Aussie Wing and the Goodall Super Wing. They were designated at the time of the introduction of the big rig in the early 90's. The Aussie wing was designed originally for A's and was well outside of it's comfort zone on a Stingray. There are few left sailing and i think it's only luch which has saved them. They haven't been available new for a long time and sadly the designer/builder, Ken Austin has alzheimers. The super wing is much more robust being a development by Greg of the Italian Sori mast used by A's in the 80's. I've been using one on my Stingray for 11 years and I only get concerned about it in strong wind when de-rotated a bit. I believe it is marginal with crew weight above 150kg in big breeze. It is also not available in the length needed for a Stingray. The measurement schedule does provide that should either section not be commercially available the Class Association can approve an alternative. Work is proceeding to approve a commercially available section and the suggestion is the C2 section. It's not much stiffer for and aft than the super wing and is 9mm bigger fore and aft and not much heavier. I believe it to be a very viable section particulary for heavier crews and those who might add a kite. After all the Stingray carries .5 sqm more sail area in the main and .95 sqm in the jib more than an F18. I'd have no concerns about it and Greg Goodall agrees with me. There's no problem with sail size in changing the mast. Stingray rules measure the sail area without mast at 15.8 sqm. The mast is defined separately by it's width and fore and aft length. So a 15.8 sqm sail can go on any approved mast section. F18 rules measure total mast ans sail area as do A's. I'd be interested in why you feel the f18 mast with bigger sails and a lighter boat than an F18 would be slow. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madboutcats Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 Look forward to catching up with you Brian you know I love the Stingray, perhaps you should just buy a blank Stingray mast section incase you forget to sheet on your main wth the spinnaker, thats the only time your spin will cost you a mast. By all mean's listen to some manufacturerer that says use a section just because it's the only one he wants to supply, a mate of mine was told he would go faster on his Taipan 5.7 with a F18 rig by a manufacturer which is doubtful. Why would your beautiful light weight cat with hulls around 100kg need to carry the same load as a 180kg F18? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madboutcats Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 Sorry John you posted as I was posting my earlier reply I don't think it would be slow except in light wind with the extra weight, I didn't realise the mast wasn't in the measurement so that changes things a fair bit. I now think you would be crazy not to change masts. When I rotated my bigrig mast upwind and sheeted on it used to lay the mast over so it was a compromise, now with the squaretop main you can have full rotation and extra sail area including the mast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitchlb44 Posted January 18, 2011 Report Share Posted January 18, 2011 Brian I will wait and see regarding the F18 section! I'm not yet convinced - but certainly curious! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madboutcats Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 G'day John Brian and I both reckon you gain nearly 40mm with the Capricorn mast section so I guess whatever extra weight will be offset by around .4m2 sail area and being able to pull the sail on with mast rotated. Heres a photo of latest bighead mains, a Goodall 5.7 main on the left, Ashby main 5.7 middle and Goodall main Stingray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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