tonyquoll Posted November 12, 2012 Report Share Posted November 12, 2012 Seeking advice on what type of rope to use for a mainsheet. On my Paper Tiger I use 8mm spectra, because that's what the boat came with, and it works OK. On my Laser I have 8mm "32-double braid polyester". Problem with it, is that it doesn't run through the blocks very well and drags in the water. A 6mm main is suggested. Dad's Nacra 14square has an 8:1 pulley system with an 8mm rope, and similar problem that it doesn't run through the blocks and the sail has to be pushed out, rather than just let out. When the rope was new, it often got all spiralled and twisted. Browsing a few sources, I see people recommending - Spectra; polyster wrap around High Molecular Density Polyethylene, - Rooster: Polyester Cover w/ a Polypropylene Core: http://www.roostersailing.com.au/tangle-free-mainsheet-xidc26674.html - Bzzz line, a combination of spun polyester and multi-filiment polypropylene: http://www.neropes.com/product.aspx?mid=FBAE29336C3B26FE710A6F20A0FF186C&lid=3&pid=12 - cheap polyester braid - singe braid (no cover) lines, "such as Yale Conception, Maffioli Swiftcord, and Robline Racing Sheet" - Robline is "Hollow-fiber plait of impregnated Polyamide and Dyneema SK75" http://www.ronstan.com.au/marine5/product.asp?ProdNo=RS-6BLUC#info - Maffioli appears to be a double braid, with dyneena + "no slip fibre" wrap around dyneema + polypropelene core - search for Yale conception produces results WAY off topic Has anyone good or bad experience with one of these, or recommendations? Also wondering if anyone recommends a method for softening a rope that has gone all stiff from being used in salt all season and never washed? Was thinking maybe hand-wash in a bucket with fabric softener? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darcy1945 Posted November 12, 2012 Report Share Posted November 12, 2012 Your rope softening idea is on the mark. For mainsheets I use "Dinghy Light", it is cheap and effective. 8:1 on the 14 sq is overkill, 6:1 should be adequate. The diameter of the blocks is important, (Bigger runs easier), as is the ratio (Greater ratio, greater drag) and running your sheets correctly through the blocks is paramount. An effective ratchet (off in light conditions) also helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madboutcats Posted November 12, 2012 Report Share Posted November 12, 2012 Brisbane catamaran centre have a very soft on the hand non stretch mainsheet that runs through blocks easily and doesn't tangle, they sell it quite cheap and I use it on the 5.8. I take my sheets and blocks off every couple of weeks and soak them in a bucket with a bit of washing detergent and fabric softener. Your blocks will have crud inside them which chews up the inners and your sheets will take a few bucket loads. Stick them in a bucket still on the blocks full of warm water and washing detergent them vigorously wash them up and down after a minute you wont be able to see your sheets, leave this mix about an hour slosh it around again for a while. Tip the water out and do a fabric softener and detergent mix in warm water slosh them around a bit and leave for 2 days giving them a slosh every now and then. After that rinse them out with warm water in the bucket keep sloshing and changing the water until you have no more soap bubbles, that way you know your sheets wont slip. Do it all again in 2 weeks time and a lot more dirt will come out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyquoll Posted November 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2012 Thanks for that. Good cleaning tips! FSE Robline "Dinghy Light" is a double-braid polypropelene. I found the FSE Robline brochure (10Mb): http://www.wet-tech.vanryndesign.com.au/FSE%20Robline%20Brochure.pdf This titles it "the ultimate dinghy sheet and multi-purpose rope", and says "it is used wherever low water absorption is crucial, making it particularly recommendable for use as a light-weight spinnaker sheet." It is light, but relatively weak: eg: 6mm holds 500daN, compared to the Spectra-like "Dinghy Control"; 6mm holds 1200daN. But that's not an issue with mainsheets, where feel and function are the critical factors. Darcy; where did you get this stuff? I haven't found a retailer of Robline yet. Binks Marine http://binksmarine.com.au/ mentioned "Southern Lights" rope by Donaghy, as an alternative to the Robline Racing Sheet. They offer blue 6mm at $3.50/m and said they modified it: "thread a 3mm Dynex down the inside to reduce stretch and give the rope some more body" http://www.donaghys.com.au/spectradyneema.html#southernlights They also suggested FSE Robline "Dinghy Sheet", and Rooster ropes. The 8:1 blocks on the Nacra 14sq came after substantial testing, in order to provide enough force to pull the leech tight(ish). The sail cut and rigid mast seem to require extra force. Also the skipper isn't after a heavy workout. It's pretty much the Harken beach cat system pictured here: http://www.harken.com/rigtips/mainsheet.php The Laser blocks are of course standard, limited by one-design rules. I searched for Brisbane Cat centre, which led to the Nacra website: no ropes, just boats. I'm guessing a soft, non-stretch mainsheet that is cheap, would be double-braid polyester. The concept of a single-braid, with no wrap, seems to be that when the rope is pulled tight, the wrap tends to slip. When the load is eased, the weave tends to make the rope twist, and this leads to tangles. The "Rooster" rope goes for stretchy polypropelene core with stronger polyester wrap, so that the wrap will never slip and therefore it wont get tangled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knobblyoldjimbo Posted November 12, 2012 Report Share Posted November 12, 2012 Jimmy Buckland (Buckland Marine Charmhaven) has the dinghy light. It's actually 7/16 so it's 7. something mm which means it runs through the really small Harken 19mm blocks (which the 8mm stuff won't go through). Maybe Mick will chime in, he uses something that's a bit knobbly but easy to hold and runs through quite well. I think it's pricey though, I also think that Marko uses it. The dinghy light is good though although I capsized on Saturday (big puff and lift at the same time - no time to uncleat) and one of the Gun Guys said "this isn't the weather to cleat the main"!! Suitably humbled I was wondering what others use! Maybe just pain will be what I have to bear. The dinghy light costs about $1.1 a metre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madboutcats Posted November 12, 2012 Report Share Posted November 12, 2012 You can get Robline through Rick Whites catsailor.com website, you could contact Robbie here on this catsailor.net site and see if he can get some for you, I've bought it at Binks in the past and they didn't know they had it when I was talking on the phone to them. I had it on my Taipan 5.7 downhaul, it is fantastic rope for smooth running through small blocks, it was the only rope that let my 24 to 1 downhaul ease quickly. Brisbane Catamaran Centre is 07 33754911 they don't do on line retail but if you ring them you will find Rosco and Warren a wealth of info and they will send it to you straight away. They manufacture cats from 12ft to 19ft here in Australia so carry all the bits and pieces required to finish these boats. They get the 8mm mainsheet made for them specifically for Nacra Infusion F18 and Nacra 5.8's, when you pay $27,000 for a new F18 this main sheet comes on it and I can tell you it is 1000 times more comfortable and smoother running than Spectra, I may have misled you by saying it is cheap, it's not super cheap like a polyester but it is cheap for what it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyquoll Posted November 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2012 Sounds good! It makes sense that the more flexible polypropelene material will bend around the blocks better, so will run through more easily. I don't have cleats on the mainsheet of any boat I sail. To make that feasible, need to have a good ratchet block and enough pulley ratios. I like the Harken Auto-ratchet on my PT, as you can adjust the spring tension at which the ratchet engages. I found the Ronstan one holds the sheet better, but never lets go and makes it difficult to ease the sheet. You have to completely unload the sheet for the ratchet to disengage; but possibly it works better with the thinner rope. No website for Buckland Marine, so still looking for a supplier. Email received from Drew at www.wet-tech.vanryndesign.com.au : FSE Robline "Dinghy Light" - 8mm Red/Yellow Fleck: $2.80/metre Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TornadoSport260 Posted November 13, 2012 Report Share Posted November 13, 2012 Sounds good! It makes sense that the more flexible polypropelene material will bend around the blocks better, so will run through more easily. I don't have cleats on the mainsheet of any boat I sail. To make that feasible, need to have a good ratchet block and enough pulley ratios. I like the Harken Auto-ratchet on my PT, as you can adjust the spring tension at which the ratchet engages. I found the Ronstan one holds the sheet better, but never lets go and makes it difficult to ease the sheet. You have to completely unload the sheet for the ratchet to disengage; but possibly it works better with the thinner rope. No website for Buckland Marine, so still looking for a supplier. Email received from Drew at www.wet-tech.vanryndesign.com.au : FSE Robline "Dinghy Light" - 8mm Red/Yellow Fleck: $2.80/metre Liros Magic Pro (aka Lightning Line) from Deckhardware.com.au. The other way is Liros Dyna Grip also from Deckhardware.com.au Magic Pro http://www.deckhardware.com.au/-categories/rope_cordage/liros_dinghy_rope/liros_magic_pro_01507/ Dyna Grip http://www.deckhardware.com.au/-categories/rope_cordage/liros_dinghy_rope/liros_dynagrip_02009/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TornadoSport260 Posted November 13, 2012 Report Share Posted November 13, 2012 I ran the Magic Pro in 6mm for 2 seasons with a 6:1 Harken 40mm triple top and 40mm triple rachet bottom on the Windrush and I couldn't find anything about the line i didn't like. It had unnoticable stretch ran through the blokes better than anything i've had before and i've used FSE lines before. I also have a 10m or 12m length of Dyna Grip, I've not used it because the Magic Pro was such a good rope. My partner races NS14's (3rd at the 2011/12 nationals) and her skipper uses Dyna Grip for a mainsheet. It's quite soft and gives good control based on his reports. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyquoll Posted November 13, 2012 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2012 Thanks. After reading that I went through the Liros catalog and checked DeckHardware prices. Liros Magic Pro is a double-braid polyester wrap over dyneema core. They add "grip-fibre" to the wrap and "grip coating" to the core, which possibly stops the wrap slipping along the core. That would help stop it twisting and tangling, and provide an advantage over Spectra. 6mm is $6.85/m. 8mm is $12.45/m Liros Dyna Grip is a single-braid of dyneema and polyester "grip fibre". 6mm is $4.42/m. 8mm is $11.85/m. Following the logic that the flexible polypropylene will bend around blocks better and run more freely, and that a single braid will avoid problems of wrap slip, twisting and tangling, then how about a single-braid polypropylene rope? Liros Nautic is polypropylene multifilament 8-plait. 8mm is just $1.60/m Would that work? Or, perhaps the softer material will get chewed to bits in the ratchet? Also got a reply from PSA, the Laser distributors, who offer "custom made mainsheet, 5mm / yellow or 7mm / blue. It is very similar to the rooster mainsheets" (polyester wrap over polypropylene core). Bit under $3/m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TornadoSport260 Posted November 13, 2012 Report Share Posted November 13, 2012 What you'll find about Magic Pro is that the Dyneema core will give you basically NO stretch underload, so everybit of energy you put in is directly applied. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyquoll Posted November 13, 2012 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2012 Gee, there sure are plenty top choose from! Based on spec, without actually seeing, handling or testing any of these, here's my pick: For catamarans, with 6:1 or higher mainsheets, where the priority is a rope that runs well through pulleys: 1/ 6mm LIROS Magic Pro: polyester wrap over dyneema core, $6.85/m from Deckhardware (link above) Reasoning: as said above; wont stretch, thin size runs well through blocks, polyester wrap OK to handle. Internal grip coating stops wrap slipping and makes it better than Spectra 2/ 8mm FSE Robline DinghyLight: polypropylene wrap and core, $2.80/m from Wet-tech (link above) Reasoning; 8mm is easier to handle, and in that diameter the stretch shouldn't me noticable. The stretchier material will bend well and should run well through blocks well. Should also be soft and nice to handle. As Darcy said "Cheap and effective" For a dinghy such as Laser, where the priorities are lightweight that wont hang and drag through the water downwind, runs through the blocks well, and wont tangle too much in the cockpit: 1/ 7mm FSE Robline "Racing Sheet": a single-braid polyester+Dyneema blend, which is both strong & good to handle. With no wrap it avoids the problems of wrap slip, twist and tangling. $6.50/m from Wet-tech 2/ 7mm Rooster rope, which seems identical in construction to this LIROS Magic Sheet: they have polyester wrap over polypropylene core, so the wrap wont slip over the stretchier core; avoiding twisting and tangling. $3.25/m at: http://www.nzsailing.net/the-concept-behind-rooster-ropes-polilite-mainsheet-xidc26674.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErvinGardner Posted June 26, 2013 Report Share Posted June 26, 2013 Seeking advice on what type of rope to use for a mainsheet. On my Paper Tiger I use 8mm spectra, because that's what the boat came with, and it works OK. On my Laser I have 8mm "32-double braid polyester". Problem with it, is that it doesn't run through the blocks very well and drags in the water. A 6mm main is suggested. Dad's Nacra 14square has an 8:1 pulley system with an 8mm rope, and similar problem that it doesn't run through the blocks and the sail has to be pushed out, rather than just let out. When the rope was new, it often got all spiralled and twisted. Browsing a few sources, I see people recommending - Spectra; polyster wrap around High Molecular Density Polyethylene, - Rooster: Polyester Cover w/ a Polypropylene Core: http://www.roostersailing.com.au/tangle-free-mainsheet-xidc26674.html - Bzzz line, a combination of spun polyester and multi-filiment polypropylene: http://www.neropes.com/product.aspx?mid=FBAE29336C3B26FE710A6F20A0FF186C&lid=3&pid=12 - cheap polyester braid - singe braid (no cover) lines, "such as Yale Conception, Maffioli Swiftcord, and Robline Racing Sheet" - Robline is "Hollow-fiber plait of impregnated Polyamide and Dyneema SK75" http://www.ronstan.com.au/marine5/product.asp?ProdNo=RS-6BLUC#info - Maffioli appears to be a double braid, with dyneena + "no slip fibre" wrap around dyneema + polypropelene core - search for Yale conception produces results WAY off topic Has anyone good or bad experience with led light, or recommendations? Also wondering if anyone recommends a method for softening a rope that has gone all stiff from being used in salt all season and never washed? Was thinking maybe hand-wash in a bucket with fabric softener? Have you got the right answer for it? I am looking to get mainsheet so which will you recommend.. Highly reliable and affordable as well.Waiting for reply thanks in advance:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knobblyoldjimbo Posted June 30, 2013 Report Share Posted June 30, 2013 If you're near the Central Coast, get the dinghy light, it's about $1.1 from Jimmy Buckland on Arizona Road. It is slightly smaller than 8mm (I'd say 5/16). I certainly found that 8mm standard stuff from Bias didn't got through the Harken micro blocks I was using but the dinghy light did. Anyway it's cheap so a mainsheet length would cost about $12 while the posh stuff looks like about $150!! You may need to consider that any 8mm line might not be big enough for the traveller. There's a lot of pressure in that 2:1 system so I have 10mm rope - doesn't slip out of the cleat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whollsee Posted July 1, 2013 Report Share Posted July 1, 2013 Ah...all the pretty ropes. It's like fishing where "lures catch more people than fish!" Having said that I love the liros stuff just $$$. Deckhardware are usually at syd boat show and do discounts for that event. Coming up soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyquoll Posted July 1, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 1, 2013 In response to query above, I found several right answers: I've used 7mm FSE Robline Dinghy Sheet on Laser & Maricat. Got it from Binks Marine at $2.20/m, they don't list it in their online catalogue; you have to call or email and request it. The good about this one is that it runs through the blocks really well, and resists tangling. The bad is you need special gloves get a good grip on it; such as Zhik's Latex covered ones (or similar latex coated gardening gloves). After a season of use this is still as-new, and other guys at the club liked it so much 3 of us now have mains made from this. For Dad's Nacra 14square (with 8:1 mainsheet system), we got 6mm Donaghy's Southern Lights at $3.20/m from All Marine: http://www.allmarine.com.au/shop/rope-and-wire-fittings/rope/southern-lights/ This is very light, easy to handle and flies through the blocks. Dad's uses Ronstan gloves on it & seems very happy with it. On my PT, I'm still using Spectra, which I measure at 7mm; even though it's only made in 6mm or 8mm. That's one of the difficult things; size seems to vary substantially between manufacturers. So-called 8mm 32-Double Braid Polyester would not fit in blocks designed for 8mm rope, and was more like 9mm; similar to k.o.b's comment above. Worth getting a short sample before investing in a big length of the wrong rope! That particular Spectra rope is now possibly 20 years old; definitely done 5 hectic seasons with me, and is still in great shape. After it went stiff I chucked some .60c fabric softener & warm water in a bucket, soaked it overnight, rinsed it out and then it was soft and flexible as anything; better than new. Now doing that regularly with all my ropes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul124ac Posted July 1, 2013 Report Share Posted July 1, 2013 +1 for the Liros 6mm, runs beautifully thru my 9:1 system and more importantly thru the trav. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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Guest qsrivwkji Posted July 9, 2013 Report Share Posted July 9, 2013 ルイヴィトン タイガ パラナ セカンドバッグ グリズリ m30758 ショルダーバッグ ブランド 人気 もうチェーン、唯一の99セントは、豪華なロデオドライブで不動産を狙っている。 119.05。レポーター：経済の残りの部分が後退してきたがドルの店が拡大している。今、我々は戻って私たちの財布とメントスの半分パックを持っているとザックは完全に彼が何を残し何もないスラムに落ちた方法忘れてしまったが、市場の周りに安いミニ日付にエアリスを扱うこと。あなただけの物語を続けるために次の段落まで飛ばしますが、あなたのことができなかったので、このようなものはいずれも必須ではありません。あなたは理由を知っていますか？これは共産主義後援クライシスコアのチュートリアルであり、あなたはその卯月の記事はここにすべての少し厳しいと愚かな退屈な作業を行いますので。 任意のチャネルパートナーマーケティングプログラムのロケーション、透明になります。あなたのドメインがシベリアのサーバーでホストされている場合は、いないだけで、ロンドン、パリにあるサーバー上で自分のサイトを立ち上げた人としてあなたのインターネットビジネスでの成功のちょうど同じくらいのチャンスを立って、またはニューヨーク。つまり、あなたのインターネットビジネスで何を心配すべき？トラフィック - 従来のビジネスと同じもの。 ルイヴィトン モノグラム マヒナ クラッチ アメリア 長財布（クラッチバッグ） アカジュー M58125 大きい財布 それをすべてオフに先頭に、任意の生徒は教科書は貸付金の彼らの "脂肪財布"、連続学期後学期を引き抜いた後、非常に高価であることを認めることができます。単一の教科書のために190ドルを支払うよりも悪いとは何ですか？学生は学期が終わったその本で何をしますか？大学の書店には、教科書で取引するとき、彼らはすべてでそれを買い戻すかどうもともと、支払われたことのなく、単なる一部を支払うことをしたくない。このオンライン会場は、特にバック使用教科書を販売するためにこれらの過拡張の生徒に合わせた合法的な、専用の教科書の買い戻しプログラムを提供しています。ISIS - T-MobileとVerizonはATは彼らISISアプリケーションとのシームレスなモバイル決済インフラになることを想定しものを作成するために力を合わせました。アプリは小売報酬カードを追跡することに加えて、デジタルカードの画像の形でクレジットカードやデビットカードの情報を格納するためのビザとマスターカードで動作します。ユーザーが利用できるか、現在のバランスですどのくらいのお金をチェックするためにカード上のカードの画像をタップを通してスワイプすることができます。 ルイヴィトン モノグラム ポルトフォイユアンソリット 長財布 ダークブラウン M60299 ヴィトン バッグ 人気 私はそれがすべてかなり必要だったので、すべて悪いというつもりはない：靴、学校供給、ショッピング、車のための新しいタグ、それがすべて終らの一週間で、新しい赤ちゃん等のマットレスが、ちょうど連結。私は家にずっといた場合、私はそれが先細りと思うだろうが、私はまた、それは、少なくとも私にとっては、SAHMようにタイトな予算で生活するのは難しいだろうと考えなければならない。あなたがあなた自身の健康やあなたの子供の健康についての懸念がある場合は、必ず医師や他の医療専門家にご相談ください。。私は右の状況下で再びそれを行うだろう。私は愛人の記事が言ったことのうち、多くを得た。彼女は光の下で新たな法案を開催し、それは大丈夫だったので、彼女は私のチケットと私の変化を与え、まだなかったのは私には言葉を言ったり、目で私を見て。これは非常に、その仕事彼らの素晴らしい美術館への訪問者を迎えるためにある、誰かがとても失礼と興味をそそらないかもしれない私には邪魔された。明らかに、この女性は彼女の仕事を楽しんでいませんでした。 品質の修理店がこの情報を提供すること、また、見積もりに概説され修理が特定の金額の10％を超えないことを保証することができるはずができます ルイヴィトン モノグラムマルチカラー ジッピーウォレット 長財布 ブラック＆ピスタッシュ M60244 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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